Jenn's Reverie
Monday, August 08, 2005
Platonic Boom
According to some comments in my post before last, platonic relationships just aren't possible. And if I really believe that they are than I am not only naive, I'm stupid. Well, for those of you that think they aren't possible, you've probably missed out on some great relationships because you weren't strong enought to keep your peter in your pants and think with your brain or heart.
I have always had male friends. Since as far back as I can remember. My freshman year of highschool, my bestfriend was JuanCarlos. We spent lots of time together. I met him through my friend/neighbor whom he used to date. They broke up, him and I became very close. His dad used to do the, "Are you sure you aren't gay? I can't believe you don't hook up with Jenn." Many, 'til this day don't believe we ever so much as kissed. He took me to homecoming, we went to movies, baseball games and anything else we could together. I actually hooked him up with another girl I hung out with alot at that time. Tried hooking him up with the step-sister, but no dice.
Eventually, I started dating my sons father and saw a little bit less of JuanCarlos. Though, we still tried to make time for eachother. He hung out with me and the new boyfriend a few times 'til he met his girlfriend. She didn't take a liking to me too well, so he slowly disappeared. She didn't want him having anyone other girl that meant something to him in his life. Even if I was just a friend.
His family always remembers my face, as does my family his. I did miss him for a really long time and wished our friendship would have remained as strong as it was. I mean, hell, we even got into an all out brawl with a brother and sister.
One of my closest and dearest friends now is Paul. I met Paul when I started to work at MCI. He was good friends with a guy I was kinda seeing at the time. One day Paul needed some advice about his relationship with his girlfriend and he was told to go talk to me by a couple of other people. So he did. He seemed to like what I had to say so he'd come back for more advice. His girlfriend didn't care. It's not she did or didn't like me. It was a whatever kinda thing. Anyhow, Paul and I ended up becoming very close. And still, people don't believe we ever so much as kissed. Never happened. Paul's absolutely gorgeous, but we were just meant to be friends. He's been with his girlfriend for about two years now and she's one of the people I like to hang out with most. She met him one night when him and I were out together. She's never once acted jealous or uncomfortable towards our relationship and I love her for it. I wasn't about to lose Paul as a friend. She doesn't care if we go out with out her and he doesn't care if we go out without him. They rock. Paul and I have tell eachother everything! Well, he tells me everything. I don't talk about sex. Not even to my girlfriends, usually. We've laughed, we've cried and we've done partied our little hearts out. My son loves him and so does my family and I'm very close to his family. I've met many good friends through him and vise versa.
Then we have Chris. I met Chris through my sons dad about 10 years ago. Chris is someone that used to drive me nuts. We'd fight alot. I hated that my ex would rather be with him partying than with me. Chris and I shared a few argumentative words, to put it lightly, in the past. Now, we're sure to keep in touch and make sure we're both doing all right. He doesn't even talk to my ex much or at all. But he is someone I'd make sure to do what I can for. I've met his girlfriends, he's met mine. He's hooked me up with his friends, I've hooked him up with mine. We can talk on the phone forever about anything and nothing.
Anyhow, those are just a few examples of platonic relationships. Those guys have never hit on me. Saying that I look pretty, or complimenting me any other way is not hitting on me. I've had many guys friends that originally wanted to hook up, but were okay with being friends. Paul tends to be more big brotherish with me. Wants to know who I'm dating and where I met him. What he's like and why he's like that. His girlfriend thinks it's funny. Even Paul's brother can be the same. His brother just recently married and had a baby with a great friend of mine.
Anyhow, platonic relationships ARE possible. You can sit and tell me 'til you're blue in the face that they just want to get in my pants, but don't waste your time. I have guy friends that aren't trying to get in anything. No, they aren't gay, no, they aren't stupid, no, they aren't ugly. Actually, they're all damn good looking. No, they aren't waiting around for a chance. Holy shit, Batman, no one would wait around for 10 years just pretending to be my friend! So quit thinking that EVERY guy only thinks with his penis, 'cause we all know they do. Hah.
Anyway, so if you've never had a successful platonic relationship, you suck. I like being able to introduce my boyfriend to my guy friends and sitting down and having a drink with them. The three example I gave you are just a few of the many great platonic relationships I've had. Three of the best, for sure. And hey, maybe they did at one time think they'd want a chance or even vise versa, but if so, it got past that and now there are friendships to last forever. I'll stand in Paul's wedding someday.
So, if you think I am only naive or stupid, then so be it. I think it's your loss. Keep wishing you could have the friends that I have.
56 Comments:
LOL at your < p > issues.
As for your main post I've come to the conclusion over the years that it is possible to have a platonic relationship with a member of the opposite sex once both parties realise that anything else is COMPLETELY out of bounds but that can be a hard thing to get to sometimes.
So said I have met a few girls over the years that are very good at setting the boundry and others that are terrible. I had one friend that I couldn't continue to be friends with because even though she knew I had a thing for her and was trying to just be friends she kept sharing a bed with me in her oh-so-fine underwear and asking me to basically spoon her. That drove me nuts! Apart from that most of my female friends of the years have been very good about keeping things "straight" during the formative period of a friendship.
The same goes the other way though, I have had problems where I have had to set female friends straight that I am with someone and "it" ain't ever gonna happen.
I think there are a fair few guys out there though who don't see women as potential friends in general though, they only see them as potential "lays" and that's just wrong if you ask me..
Quit making fun of my P issues, damnit.
Well, gambl0r, I must say thank you for being able to admit that you do think platonic relationships are possible. I'm sure someone will call you a liar.
As for the spooning chick, she just wanted affection or cuddling. Well, obviously. And to turn you on otherwise she wouldn't have done it in her panties. She knew what she was doing and I think she has self-esteem issues.
They call me Dr. Jenn.
Let's be friends?
What paragraph issues?
Oh she definitely had self esteem issues. She constantly went on about how terrible she looked while walking around in the sexiest, slinky, short as shit dresses.
If you hate your legs so much wear trousers!
That's because she wanted to hear you say, "No you don't, you have sexy legs."
I think you did, too, Mr. Lama.
What is the significance of the ball?
Jenn it shows you have alot of character
Ive also always enjoyed female company and also gotten into serious hot water for it. But in the end if people cant understand us its because they see us through there perverted minds.
Respect !
Yeah, I agree Jenn.
Although I must admit, many of my current friendships with the opposite sex started out with an initial attracttion, as time developed that window of opportunity closed and either they or I realised that it would be better to be friends rather than lovers.
But I suppose the older you get, the less of an issue it becomes really. If I click with somebody these days, its good enogh for me, I dont need to get into their pants(although its always a plus) to appreciate them.
Hey Jenn
Platonic relationships are good, cool too. Hell, ya cant bang every girl ya talk to, it's just plain tiring. I have a ton of girls that I'm just friends with, girls that I've never seen make the O face. (To quote a fantastic movie.)
Most of them though, are girls I probably would have hit on anyway. My experience has always been that if I've got the connection with a girl that I'm freinds with, and she's not involved, along with being attractive...it may only be a matter of time. Unless it passes a certain point. I think there's a point in freindship that goes beyond the hook up phase. I dont know, something deeper though. But what the hell do I know.
Oops, I meant to say wouldnt have hit on anyway. Just for clarification.
Platonic: interesting that it originally meant a relationship which "transcends(first including it, then moving beyond it) physical desire" and has come to mean a relationship "free from physical desire".
It seems to me that the word "friend" would suffice regardless of the involved genders.
I am a word geek. Sorry for intruding.
while this has been true in my life to a degree, it is better exemplified in my daughter's. She is only two years removed from high school, but the two friendships she works to maintain are with two guys she has known for many years. At first, mom and I thought each of these guys had crushes on her (and she them). But the boys are close friends and allowed her into the club, so to speak.
While she is away at college, these are the guys she talks to or IMs. At school, she has developed some other buds to hang with. It is good for in clubs, she says, and it helps her feel safe. But there is no romantic attraction.
Her boyfriend, who is still in Dallas (600 miles away), has major issues with this and would prefer her to just stay in her apartment instead of going out with friends. Of course, his family is in the next room and she is 600 miles away from everyone she has ever known.
I worry about his inability to view these relationships maturely.
i think he would hit it if you gave him the chance.. both of you have a few drinks and just go at it.
I think you can have what Prufrock defined as a platonic relationship -- I have at least one. He and I have kissed before, but it's never gone further and we are great friends. I am close with his family and he and I hang out and talk and flirt and sometimes sleep in the same bed, but when it comes down to it, we're not what each other want in the relationship department, and, not to sound cliche, but one night isn't worth the friendship. Do I think he's hot? Hell yeah, but that doesn't mean I'm incapable of being friends without trying to hook it up all the time.
I think it's possible to have a friendship with someone you find attractive -- I read somewhere that even our friends of the same sex are people we find attractive in one way or another, so it's the same thing.
I was thinking about this topic today, and I remember this great plutonic friend I had for 2 years & then she took me out for my birthday, got me drunk & had her way with me. That was sweet.
Can't have platonic relationships? There are times when I think that is all I can have.
just because you didn't ask them if they wanted to get in your pants dosn't mean that they didn't want to. i dare you to call up anyone and ask them if they would have sex with you and i bet they would jump at the chance. the reason that juan carlos 'dissapeared' is because he could get some from the other girl.
I can't believe that I actually read all of that. Pretty involved. Platonic relationships are indeed possible if one is psychologically sturdy enough to not let his/her fingers do the talking. Platonic people taste more tender as a result.
It's always the woman's fault that a friendship goes sour. They just can't be friends........they always have to want sex, sex, sex!!! Ha no I'm just kidding honestly but think about this.....is it possible to become nonsexual friends with a person you had sex with before? Now that has never worked for me. Once you have sex even if you weren't friends with them before, it always ruins something. Stop with this dirty sex talk Jenn!!! You're a saint.
Jenn - Okay, I'm going to tell you the truth, consequences be damned. Now, keep in mind, I speak for myself, but I'm the type of guy who's not afraid to be unPC.
Before I was married, I had platonic female friends. However, they were either co-workers, relatives, or friend's wives. Or they were ugly.
I could be real close to them, as long as I didn't have the slightest bit of attraction to them. (Co-workers automatically are unattractive, even if they're hot. I've always been professional that way because you don't date where you work. Very, very bad).
Now, I'm not saying that no men could be platonic with someone that's hot. I'm speaking for myself and myself alone. However, I will say that some guys won't tell you the truth how they feel because they'd value the friendship too much. But if they got a chance to see you nekkid, you can bet your heiny a lot of them would take it.
Now, I do have a few female friends that are hot. I'm married now and totally in love with my wife, so I can. However, if I didn't know my wife, I'd be hitting on them the minute they're single.
So can a good-looking woman and good-looking man be platonic? Sure, but it's not likely if they're both single and horny.
I guess we're all pretty much in agreement then, no? So where are those that bashed the idea pretty much completely? Come out, come out, wherever you are!
John: Go check out this link to see what the ball symbolizes.
http://termespheres.com/platinicrelations.html
Oh yeah, John, pretty much just pun fun. :P
Jenn, you're delusional. You know that the guys you call "friends" really just want to do you. Come on, admit it. As hot as you are, do you really believe they just like you for your brains?
...LoL. OK, I even made myself sick on that one. I sorry hun, I tried to give you a good argument, but ya just can't argue with reason.
Linny, that's not fair! The minute I read what you said, I thought about it... Therefor making any argument to the contrary null and void. :p
You know, it might also help if we decide on what we mean by "friend". Are we only talking about close friends, or anyone we call a friend?
Uodan, 9 out of 10 still leaves 1%, so platonic relationships are possible. Grade school arithmetic. :o)
*chuckle chuckle* I'm sorry, I know that was petty, but I just had to say it...
The average guy thinks about sex every 24 seconds. You are out with a guy and are a good looking female he is thinking about getting into your pants. Its a hormone thing, thanks oh testosterone the mighty. All a platonic relationship is is a guy that made a conscious decision to not try right away to get any. That won't mean he won't turn you down if you offered (unless he has strong enough desires not to, like a significant other or whatever) Try it sometime, ask one of your platonic friends to bend you over and take you right there. Tell them that you just need a physical release. Watch them not even hesitate. And yes, I do have quite a few platonic friends, as does my wife, doesn't mean that fantasies aren't thought about.
99% of my friends are dudes and I'm pretty sure that only 2% want to do me.
I'm with Lloyd on this one. For all male/female relationships there has to be some initial attraction - could be physical or even mental. And not everyone acts on attraction. I have several platonic relationships and the only way they stay that way is the little invisible wall that says "closed entry." Dates gone wrong can always become platonic relationships because at some point you both decided you weren't interested. It doesn't mean the thought hasn't been there and yes... men think about it. Men wonder how they hang, how it's trimmed, what color the nipple is... they think about that and more just watching someone walk by. If you are around often enough, the thoughts will be there. I have a very good female friend, Tracy. We are about as platonic as it gets but thoughts happen and thoughts only have weight when action follows.
Peter? I don't call him peter, he is Big Al and the twins to you girl!
Platonic, yuk
I loved this..I agree with you 100%. I have always had far more guy friends..I think theres alot less drama with a guy friend..Its more of a what you see is what you get.. its easier.
Platonic Friend #1: Okay, take your seats, I'm bringing this meeting of Jenn's Friend That Haven't Boned Her to order, lessee, uh, old business, secretary, read the minutes.
PF2: Uh, minutes of the last meeting were read, reports were recieved indicating no one had boned Jenn despite various ploys. Then the meeting adourned.
PF1: Okay, uh, new business. PF3, how did you do?
PF3: I hung out at her place for a while, we watched some hockey, and then we made hot dogs.
PF!: Did you?
PF3: Fuck no.
PF1: ARGHH! What about you?
PF4: We went to go see Dukes of Hazzard. No boning.
PF1: Alright, alright, hold it down, everyone. Oh, uh, I went shopping with her at Pottery Barn, no boning.
PF2: Goddamnit! I've been hanging out with her for six years and nothing!
PF1: Shuttup until the chair recognizes you! Okay, did anyone bone Jenn? No? Let the record reflect that no one said anything.
PF2: Motion to adjourn.
PF3: Seconded. I gotta pick up her kid.
PF1: All for? Let the record reflect that all voted 'aye'. Next JFWHBH meeting is next Wednesday like normal, and please check the schedule to see if you are supposed to bring beer next week, some of you are slacking. Meeting adjourned.
[Oh, and HAHAHAHHA Rae]
Jenn said: "I've met his girlfriends, he's met mine."
Did you people miss this bit? Jenn is finally out of the closet. Uh huh, yeah. :D
If I can have a conversation about sex with an attractive woman and I don't think about having sex with her, I know that I have reached a "platonic" state of mind.
These platonic relationships have helped me become more self-aware (in the sense of knowing one's self) than I would have been without them. There are just some things that a guy won't talk about with another guy or with a woman he is having sex with, no matter how close the relationship.
Just out of -personal- curiosity, did you guys ever befriend a chick (like, during your HS years,) just in hopes of hooking up with her 'hot' friend?
Stell: Chicks are hot, but I'm straight, yo. :P
Phelps: Hahahahah! Too cute. Punk.
Ilimitable voices: I don't have those conversations with my girlfriends for the most part, but all three of the guys that I've mentioned have had no problems sharing their stories or asking me for advice. And you're so right that guys will tell girls things they won't tell other guys. For one, they don't have to worry about being a pansy and all that comes with the territory of testorone.
If you've honestly had a sexual conversation with an attractive woman, then one of two things happened. You were drunk and obviously in a state of mind that wouldn't let you think about having sex with the said attractive woman, OR you were scared to death of the obviously out of your league woman.
I appreciate you trying to sound sensitive about sexual conversations with hot women, but you are flat out lying when you say that you NEVER thought of having sex with the attractive woman.
Platonic relationships ARE possible.
Heya! I can't read through all the replies, but here is my opinion:
Platonic CAN work and does, as long as you WEREN'T LOVERS before.
I tried to remain good/best friends with a former girlfriend and we relapsed! Then had huge "I hate you" breakups. Three times, LOL! So now, there's nothing left of us except shreds... Although I do have about 3 great friends that are girls... like sisters in a way (but never dated, etc. before)
Some people are made to be lovers and some are made to be friends. Some are just made to irritate and others to listen to Audioslave with!
;-)
j
I would have to both agree and disagree with some of the privious comments. Is it poosible to have platonic relationships? Sure. Do some relationships start based on mutual attraction? Sure. Do all platonic relationships start off this way? Nope.
I have had platonic relations start from shared interests, work, just simple friendships, or any number of things. However, some of these developed into something else later on. ie...A friend with benefits. Which never last.
I do agree that as you get older, it is easier to develop long term platonic relationships. Not as much testosterone flowing through the body, may have something to do with it.
Thanks for the post. I will keep my big toes away from you.
Any man that says that they are capable of a 100% platonic relationship with a woman is either lying or incapable or finding women attractive.
Any person that is married and says that their best friend is someone of the opposite sex and is not their spouse is not living their married life as God intended, and should really question why they are married to begin with.
Ah. yes. The paltonic relationship. Been there. The odd thing was that it stemmed from a short high school relationship that ended on less than good terms. It took a few months before we even talked to each other and this while we worked together. In a few months, though, we were back to being the best of friends. We were inseparable. Every night we had free we spent together. We had our relationships with others along the way but neither of us really had any luck. Our friends always assumed that we were dating. After correcting them they went ahead and said that we should be dating. Whatever the case, we are still good friends even though we now live on opposite ends of the country. When we still lived in th same town, we even dreamed about getting old together and the whole thing tha if neither of us were married by 'X' we would tie the knot. Deep inside we knew it would be weird to make something more out of the best friendship either of us had ever had. It's fun to dream, though.
The last anonymous said, "Any person that is married and says that their best friend is someone of the opposite sex and is not their spouse is not living their married life as God intended, and should really question why they are married to begin with."
Well, now that takes things in a while other direction. I do NOT think that someone who is married and has friends of the opposite sex is not living their marriage as God intended. I think that if one of them has a problem with the other having platonic relationships then THAT is where there's a problem.
Jealousy? Jealousy is common and not necessarily a bad thing, but to a point. To not trust simply because of jealousy is unhealthy.
Insecurities? That's unhealthy for anyone. Insecurities can lead to an unhealthy state of jealousy.
A guilty conscious? Well, that explains itself.
Previous cheating by either of the two?
Any of those things would be reason to not be comfortable with your spouse having friends of the opposite sex.
I don't think that because a married man or woman has a friend of the opposite sex that they are wrong in their marriage. I think it's wrong to think that even your spouse belongs to only you. They belong to only you in many ways, but a friend is not one of them.
It's fairly easy to have a platonic friendship with someone you met when you were young. After people reach their teenage years, they instinctively hunt for a match. Most (certainly not all) of my male friends are people who I at one point had some fleeting interest in. But that interest
sometimes leads you to talk to
people you otherwise wouldn't have and it's a vehicle to forming friendships that really are platonic.
At any rate, I believe having platonic relationships with the opposite sex is possible, although
I think in most cases, there will always be a little bit of temptation to make more of things.
Ooooo Jenn. You rock!
I've been looking at this conversation as pretty much: You can't really understand a platonic relationship until you've been there, but as long as it's not hurting anyone, it's fun to discuss and soak in other person's opinions...
But dude done went and brought God into the mix, and that ain't cool.
I agree with everything (other than maybe your last sentence, which may have just been a misunderstanding on my part) you said, Jenn... And not just because I'm kissing ass.
While I don't really care for religion, and I'm not even sure I believe in 'God' anymore, it still irritates the crap out of me when someone hides their own insecurities behind both.
I trolled over here from Kurt's A Ripple over these thousand hills site, and hope y'all don't mind my intruding on your conversation. I wanted to weigh in on one little side comment.
Jenn said: The last anonymous said, "Any person that is married and says that their best friend is someone of the opposite sex and is not their spouse is not living their married life as God intended, and should really question why they are married to begin with."
Well, now that takes things in a while other direction. I do NOT think that someone who is married and has friends of the opposite sex is not living their marriage as God intended. I think that if one of them has a problem with the other having platonic relationships then THAT is where there's a problem.
I agree AND disagree with you Jen. Close friends of the opposite sex are one thing. BEST friends are another. A married person shouldn't have someone of the opposite sex as their best friend. There is a level of intimacy in being best friends that undercuts the marriage relationship and the friendship shared between partners. Intimacy in marriage is built on much more than the physical. The physical comes out of the intimacy that allows partners to be vulnerable in a unique and special way. The descriptions I've been reading in these posts of platonic friendships actual sound to me like the beginnings of some potential lifelong matings. Sometimes sex just gets in the way of the best parts of the relationship. Once that level of intimacy is gained the physical is that much better. We may not pound the mattress all night and all day like we did when we were younger, but many an old married fart is having the best sex of their lives right now!
Wake of the Flood: I realized that anonymous said BEST friend after I had already commented.
I do agree with you. Friends are one thing and bestfriends are another.
Though, I have many BEST friends, TRUE friends, I have but one.
I guess it's a matter of how you perceive things, as with all the world.
P.S. I'm the las anonymous.
Wake of the Flood makes a good point, and explained it pretty well. Thank you!
If that's what you meant anonymous, I apologize. :o)
Unfortunately it is impossible to have a romantic platonic relationship, as the definitation if platonic includes "the absence of romance" in it.
It's interesting that some guy thought it wasn't cool to bring God into the mix. The point I was making was about BEST friends as it relates to MARRIAGE. To most people, marriage is a sacred and religious act...why wouldn't God be brought into it?
I'm sorry if you don't believe in God, and that is certainly your right, but that doesn't negate the millions of others that do believe in God. Furthermore, just because everyone doesn't believe as you do, that there is no God, that doesn't brand the topic as not cool.
I also think that everyone should take a strong look at their definition of friends. I have seen people on this thread talk about cuddling and sleeping in the same bed with someone of the opposite sex when referring to friends. Some have said that sharing the same interest or meeting someone at work makes you friends, and some even think that merely sharing intimate thoughts constitutes friendship.
In the end, a friend is whatever you want him or her to be. To me, someone that I merely share interests with or that I work with is an acquaintance. To me, a friend is someone that you hang out with, go to movies with, play sports with...someone that would drop everything they are doing to pick me up when my car is broken down an hour away.
No offense, but I just shared intimate thoughts with all of you, and none of you are my friends, so just because you can talk to someone about intimate thoughts and feelings doesn't mean their are friends. Often times, it is easier to tell strangers your intimate thoughts and feelings than it is your friends.
What should be clear is that someone that cuddles and shares the same bed with someone of the opposite sex is absolutely kidding theirselves if they think that is simply platonic. If any guy over the age of 10 is being honest with himself, he wouldn't be cuddling with or sleeping in the same bed with their best guy friend, so that alone holds the same activity with a female in a standard that supercedes platonic. I understand that some women don't have a problem sleeping in the same bed with another woman that's a friend, but guys just don't.
Ultimately, a friend is someone that you would want to be honest with you. All I'm saying is that everyone needs to be honest with themselves as well. To the VAST majority of guys, if they are being completly honest, even they don't believe in platonic friends, much less have a platonic friend.
Well... I can't really argue how a guy feels, because I'm not a guy. But you pretty much said it yourself, it all depends on how you define friendship. We now know where you're coming from, but whose to say that all guys see it the same way?
BTW, I don't know if you saw that or not, but I did apologize. I misunderstood what you said, but Wake was nice enough to explain. :o)
As for bringing God into the mix, I thought it was pretty clear that I didn't approve of how you brought God into the mix (which was part of the misunderstanding, mind you,) not just that you brought him into it. I could explain why it irritated me, but we'll save that for a more appropriate post ;o)
Look, I just bought a computer and after I move next month, I'll be getting dsl. This long lost blog buddy will return! But be patient little one.
About the whole platonic thing. Sure it's possible, as long as it's been made clear by one party that there isn't any and never will be any interest. However, most people can't do it well. I've never had a problem with girl friends, but then again, I'm more the loner type. My current count of close friends is zero, but I'm 'friends' with lots of people.
Averaged over five year terms the usual male-female, non-professional relationship is affected by gender issues which peak after eighteen months, after which potential sexual interest dwindles to a level equal to non-sexual acquaintances.
All right, I'm changing my stance. I've been too nice.
No. If I were single, I couldn't be platonic with a hot chick, unless she had some real annoying traits that will ruin her sexiness, like smelling like a European or chewing scrambled eggs with her mouth open.
Cultureshocked sent me some hot pics of this one Polish chick and I'm just thinking there's no way. I look at her and I'm thinking, I cannot sit in the same room with her and hold back. I'll be trying to get her nekkid.
I couldn't be platonic with that Polish chick. I couldn't be platonic with Monica Bellucci. And I'll readily admit, I have some hot female friends that if I were single, I'd be making a move on.
My last post was too nice. There you have it unedited.
Oh, and that latest picture of you is hot. You changed your pic again. If I were single, I'd be hitting on you too, unless of course you ate scrambled eggs with your mouth open.
Screw Plato and his whole idea of platonic love. See, there are two types of people in the world. There are people who have sex on a regular basis, and there are philosophers.
By the way, Cultureshocked, if you read Jenn's blog, you have great taste in women. Thanks for the pics.
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