Jenn's Reverie
Thursday, March 30, 2006
Making Illegal Immigrants Criminals
Discuss! (Click here for story)
posted by Jenn Doll at 12:38 AM
I am Jenn. This is my blog. Fantastic, eh?
About Me
- Name: Jenn Doll
- Location: United States
"With an empty liquor bottle, cigarette between my lips. . ." Duke City Darlin'
28 Comments:
mankind is so far away from beeing a nice thing
my brother (wake) posted on this topic from a similiar, although less hysterical, point of view than the article you link.
It is my opinion that the US is a country of immigrants, but is also a country supposedly "under the rule of law." It is a cooperative existence we have here, in that each of us needs to respect or at least acquiesce to the laws of the land. Picking and choosing which laws we will follow and those we will disregard undermines the tacit agreement in place with all of us. Law and order (a trite phrase) are dependent on the willing complience of the population. Irag is a perfect example of what happens when a particular group feels entitled to create and follow their own ideals. Gang law is predominate in some inner cities of our own country. The result is a form of anarchy/chaos that furthers oppresses the weak, the poor and the disadvantaged.
In seeking to move the penalties from the individual undocumented workers to those taking advantage of their status (employers and various poverty pimps), the intention of the bill is a positive. "Follow the money" is always good advice for examining groups' motives and I think we may need to do that in this case too. Who is paying for the bussing of protesters from Oregon to California? What could be their hidden motives? Are they only interested in vilifying their political opponents by using the issue and those effected by it?
It is time for the country to realize that this "problem" is here to stay and we also need to deal with securing our borders. Reasonable debate, leadership and humane solutions are needed here. I am hopeful the Senate, with the bi-partisan efforts of John McCain and Ted Kennedy may produce what we need.
And I think it would be great if the manager of the Wal-Mart store and the priest in charge of the food bank were to both be in the same jail cell.
My main question...
if you look at the local section of today's San Diego paper you'll see a picture of a young mexican chap standing on the sombrero of a statue waving a Mexican flag. Now, regardless of which way you're goin in this whole illegal immigration discussion, the constant argument I am hearing from chaps like he who is on the sombrero is: "America has always been the promised land, a land of dreams - we want the same thing! We want to experience the American dream! Let us stay!"
so in light of that argument - which specifically shines on the benefits that this country, America, has to offer - combined with the fact that they want to stay in America... well, then... uh... why isn't that guy on the sombrero waving an American flag? Perhaps this is the most confusing part for me.
WOW! What a simple topic! I have read the linked article an I noticed one HUGE misconception. Immagrants are not afforded the smae protections as bona fide US Citizens as it should be. To make this "crystal clear" immagrants should have certain protections, however, not the "full" set of protections until they achieve US Citizenship. Concerning illegal immigrants, are we discussing the Hispanic, Oriental,European, Russian, Extra- terrestrial,or Canadian populations of illegals?
OK ... ITS EARLY ... AND I CAN'T SPELL ...
Putting aside the fact the unless you're ancestors are native american (as the terms imply) then you too are an illegal immigrant, naturalized under the laws of the US government. There was no "american" until a law said "if you are born here, this is what you are". Criminalization is NOT the solution. Secure Borders are a fiction, because borders are a fiction. As Michelle Maklin put it "Yes, borders. Last time I checked a map of North America, they still do exist." ON MAPS!!! its an imaginary line created by governments to say "you are different, stay over there" I played the same game with my sister in the backseat of the family wagon on raod trips.
What really irks me is that while we complain that these folks are "taking" jobs, govt benefits, etc., our country supported by this admin. continues to export tens of thousands of jobs overseas each year. Should there be a "guest worker" program, sure. It makes sense to have workers documented and paying taxes and being paid fair wages in safe enviornments. Should non-particpants be made felons, HELL NO!
I'm far from a flag waver but for some reason the abundance of flags other than US did strike me as odd. I don't have a problem with it, as I understand (although don't partake in) strong national pride, but it does seem an odd venue to express that particular feeling.
Illegal immigrants are criminals, or else they would be called "immigrants". And no, the first New World settlers were not illegal immigrants; they complied with the laws at the time on immigration, which were "none".
My real problem isn't with the immigrants. My problem is that Mexico encourages them to do it, subsidizes it, encourages them not to assimilate and to remain separate, and does it in a defiant manner. In my eyes, that isn't the act of an ally -- you don't send your people to break the laws of an ally. You send your people to break the laws of an enemy that you are invading.
You know, it has been just over 100 years since Texas had a border skirmish with Mexico. I think we are just about due.
"Illegal" is illegal for a reason.
We have resources, like hospitals, near the border that are maxed out beyond capacity. The rash of illegals is a drain on our resources, however, I think this bill is preying on fears.
As a child of immigrants to the U.S., I am all for allowing citizens that are law abiding to work and become residents, and eventually citizens of our great country.
Sounds like a good bill to me. If you are here illegally, hire illegals or harbor illegals then you go to jail. If UNLV was dirt poor and lived in some 3rd world shithole I wouldn't even think twice before hoping the border, hell only penalty is a bus/plane ride home and a free lunch. If there were some sort of penalty like a 2 year stint in a Tent City style prison out in the Arizona Desert clleaning up all of the trash other illegals have left behind and building a sweet wall with gun towers, flame throwers and missle launchers to keep out more illegals then it's Look out Canada here I come!!
Nice new picture. It's about time you started showong some cleavage
Speeding is illegal (or it wouldn't be called speeding) and I bet we've all done it tons of times. Should you get two years for that?
Phelps - Its a good thing the setters came along and made up all the rules so that they got all the benefits of the laws and then commited genocide when the only non-immigrants said WTF.
I think the law applied to employers is the one that makes the most sense, they have more to lose and would thereofr be less likely to risk hiring illegals which would naturally stem some of the flow.
I think the title says it all "Illegal". If you do something illegal aren't you by definition a criminal? Or has common sense gone out the window.
Doesn't matter if it's Chinese, Mexican, Peruvian, French or anything else. Illegal is illegal.
~Jef
" I think the title says it all 'Illegal'. If you do something illegal aren't you by definition a criminal?"
Like prufrock said, everybody who drives above the maximum posted speed limit is then a criminal.
I'm such a bad-ass. I break the law every single day that I get into my car.
Where are my two years in prison?
"And no, the first New World settlers were not illegal immigrants; they complied with the laws at the time on immigration, which were 'none'."
Oh, I'm sure there were plenty of laws already in place before New World settlers made the hop...just that nobody gave a shit enough to try to learn about them.
Yes, Phelps, there is a distinction between immigration and conquest. You seem to want to forget about the whole "conquering" aspect of New World settlers.
Then again, maybe that's what the Soviets were thinking when they invaded Afghanistan. "Well, comrade, a bunch of us want to immigrate to this land of desolation. Have you heard anything about immigration laws? No? Neither have I! It's ours then!"
Anyway, most of these Mexicans - and I wish to God people would have the fuckin' balls to say what they really do - come here to work and send money back home.
"Oh, but but but but they don't get taxed!"
Yeah, but remember how we also used to say "Ooh, gubment is baaad! They pocket our tax dollars, give themselves raises, and we don't get jack shit out of it!"
So, what'll it be? I'd say the illegals are doing the SMART thing by not handing over their money to dirty politicians who are just going to pocket it.
"R" I gotta agree with you on
"So, what'll it be? I'd say the illegals are doing the SMART thing by not handing over their money to dirty politicians who are just going to pocket it."
That means I am forking hard earned dollars over to the gumment and some peasants are not so they must be treated like peasants! I hereby call prime nocte on all of the illegal's b1tches. They gotta pay somebody something so they will give me, UNLV their women for my pleasure!!
i don't believe in borders
And yet you insist that you live in a democratic nation...
Jimmy's right--move to Canada. We have police stations you can work in here too.
And I find it would be hilarious, if criminal injustice was funny, that in a "free trade" continent like North America, a bill like this exists.
Honestly Jenn, we have better beer and tattoos are free.
You know me, I refuse to speak of anything bearing importance, so how about I just say : "HEYA JENN!!!!" *jaxe hugzzzz* Miss ya!
j
Hmmm. If they are "illegal" immigrants, they are by definition lawbreakers/criminals. No need to "make" them what they already are by the nature of their actions.
-- david
Michigan's immigration rally is today in front of the State Capitol half a block from my office. I brought my camera to take pictures. My kingdom for a bumblebee costume!!!
hahah.. this whole thread of responses only serves to shine light on why my homies own all azz.
Did I mention that your new profile pic is hot?
Why is no one discussing that hot profile photo?
That lack of discussion should be illegal (as should word verifications)
oh, dear, I could go on and on about the senselessness of this bill, that serves to do nothing more but incite the ethnocentric in us all...
It won't pass, and if it does, it won't be enforced. Twenty years ago, the Reagan Administration tried something similar with their Amnesty program..what came from that
Bush knows that we NEED migrant workers to take the jobs that noone else will. Seriously, would YOU pick lettuce for 1.00 a day, no benefits, no insurance?
And this border fence we want to extend, another ridiculous waste of government time, energy, and money...didn't we try for 50 years to make East Germany tear down THEIR Wall?
I'm so off the charts!! let them come! who cares? it's obvious their own country can't provide for them, and until THAT political infrastructure is repaired, no fence will keep them out.....
jezzi
We need immigrants to polish our knobs toss our salads and sling us some tacos.
Hmmm. . . Good stuff, kiddos. HMT, what you said has really made me think.
I LOVE YOU ALL! And in my eyes, you're all illegal in some way, shape or form. Or maybe I meant special. Same difference.
so is what HMT is saying is that we should expect them to drop the vestiges of their native land and become Americans?
does that mean we make NY and SF tear down Chinatowns? or all the Korean enclaves in the cities now? seems we will need to do something about Little Italy in lower manhattan and the north side of Boston. and what about Rat - will he have to get rid of his Irish flags? and then no St. Patrick's Day parades...
Quebec has mandated something similar by making French their official language. Businesses can be fined if the receptionist answers the telephone in English before French. The signs all need to be in French and that needs to be larger than the English signs. Most business owners i know there think it is ridiculous.
Kurt - I have a feeling that anyone who tries to tear down Rat's Irish flags will get shot. ;)
Rat - I mentioned Jenn's new avatar on another post. I'm thinking Jenn gets sexier with each picture.
Jenn - It's all about legal vs illegal. With legal immigrants, we can check them out - see if they're criminals, drug addicts, America-haters, terrorists, etc. With illegal immigrants, you get good ones, and you get bad ones. Sometimes really, really bad ones unfortunately.
Oh, and as I've said before, if we want to solve Mexico's problems, how about bringing Mexico some jobs? Why are we trading so heavily with China, a country that has nukes pointed at us, instead of Mexico, a country that loves us?
Let's not forget it was Mexico who bailed California out of our energy crisis. Let's not forget it was Mexico more than anyone else who helped us when Katrina hit. I've said this a hundred times on my blog - let's help Mexico's economy. It's the least we could do for our neighbors.
But let's also keep in mind that over 40% of illegals don't come from Mexico. What about illegals from Asia, Africa, Europe, and South and central America? When are we going to crack down on them?
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